PeopleMetrics Turns 20! 3 Business Lessons from Customer Experience Entrepreneur Sean McDade PhD
To celebrate PeopleMetrics' 20th anniversary, our Founder & CEO Sean McDade PhD and other members of our team shared key business lessons from the last two decades building and working at PeopleMetrics, reflect on lessons learned from the pandemic, and share tips and inspiration for other business leaders and entrepreneurs as we kick off 2021.
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Sean McDade: ...I just want to thank every employee who's ever partnered with me at PeopleMetrics and every client. It's been my greatest privilege. Next to having children, this is my the greatest honor of my life is to work with you and serve you as clients and help you. It's been 20 years, I never could have imagined it. Here's to 20 more.
Madeline Good: Hi everyone! Welcome to #PeopleMetricsLIVE. Today is PeoplemMetrics' 20th anniversary! To celebrate, our Founder and CEO, CX entrepreneur Sean McDade, will be taking us on a journey through time to talk about business lessons he's learned over the last two decades, and we'll be joined by several members of the PeopleMetrics team here to reflect on how the CX industry has evolved over the years and talk about what we see on the horizon for the future. If you've got questions for our team, please drop them in the comments below and we'll be sure to answer them. So before we dive in, let's just do some quick introductions. My name is Madeline, and I am the Marketing Manager here at PeopleMetrics, and I joined the team in 2017 - just about four years ago. And our panelists today are of course, Sean McDade, our founder and CEO, and then Kirk Lohbauer, Audrey Squaresky, and Ripal Patel from the team here at PeopleMetrics. So why don't we go around and have you all introduce yourselves to everyone - and say what year you joined the team.
Sean McDade: Alright, I'll kick it off. Hi everybody - Sean McDade - Founder and CEO. I joined in 2001 when I started the company on January 26, 2001 - so it's 20 years today the company was founded. And I'm really happy to be here today. Hopefully this will be a fun PeopleMetrics LIVE.
Audrey Squaresky: I'm Audrey Squaresky - I'm the Director of Customer Experience here at PeopleMetrics. I joined in 2017, the same year Madeline joined, so about four years here.
Ripal Patel: Hi, my name is Ripal Patel. I joined PeopleMetrics in 2011, so I'll hit the 10 years milestone at PeopleMetrics very soon and I'm really happy about it. I joined as a system analyst and currently I'm working as a security professional as well as the developer of PeopleMetrics.
Kirk Lohbauer: Hi everybody, I'm Kirk Lohbauer. I joined in 2012. I first started as an intern and then as an analyst on our projects, then as a project manager on our projects and now I'm on the business development team - so I'm here to talk about everything we do.
Madeline: Alright, so Sean - you have been here from the very very beginning in 2001. Why don't you kick off our celebration today?
Sean: Yeah, I mean, this will be a little bit of a different PeopleMetrics LIVE! I'm going to be sort of more of the emcee today, and I'll take us through some different key events in PeopleMetrics history. We're going to do some visuals today, which we usually don't do - although every once in a while we do this. But it's 20 years and so much has changed in both the world and the customer experience employee experience industry since 2001, so we thought we'd sprinkle in some kind of nostalgic pictures of PeopleMetrics with some of the great people that have been at the company. You know, that's the first business lesson I'll share with everybody: whether you're an entrepreneur or whether you're heading a team for CX or EX - people are really everything with the business. Having great people, and there's four of my colleagues on the line here with me in the Zoom call, which are incredibly great talented people... but I think the first entrepreneurial lesson I learned... and I started this with nobody - like it was just me in an office - and I think we have a couple pictures of that office - yeah, that was the first office on 12th street. That was me in our first office - that's when I had hair back in the day. But you know, you can't do everything yourself if you're an entrepreneur. And I think entrepreneurs grow when they start allowing great people to do their job. You encourage them, you give them goals, you help them whenever possible - but at the end of the day, that's the key to any business. Believing in your people, recruiting good people, keeping them, keeping them challenged, keeping them engaged. And you know, that's just not things we say to our clients around employee experience and engagement - that's something we live at the company every day. Here's some pictures of our first office on 12th Street. That's me again, there's Deanna, which was the first employee at PeopleMetrics... Sanjeev, who is a long-term time employee at PeopleMetrics and now is at our sister company, Reason Research that broke off from PeopleMetrics five or six years ago and does custom market research work and pharmaceutical industry. We're still friends with all of them there and say hello to all of them if they're watching this today. So in the
beginning, starting this company, it was very different than today. I came from more of a traditional market research background. You know, when we did a study for a client, there'd be a lot of good design work in terms of questionnaire design - we'd put it out in the field, it was telephone interviewing, it took a while to get the interviews done, you know - weeks - and then once we get the data back, we had people creating crosstabs and then I'd get the data back and I would look through all these crosstabs and write up a report, probably six weeks after the study fielded that the client would get any results. And you know, I started PeopleMetrics because I felt like that was probably going to be too long and the world was going to converge in terms of real-time data and insights. That was our first website that we have here... and that's what we were doing. We were doing, I thought, really really good market research - as good in terms of design and analysis as anyone - but we were getting the preliminary results to clients in real-time - like as soon as the respondent hit "Submit," we would get the results to our client. And at the time, that was really really different. And now that's kind of expected in a lot of ways, but it's certainly gone... That was the beginning of some of the things that we can do today in CX is based on - like when we talk about operationalizing customer experience feedback and getting it to every member of the organization, it started there when we were just able to figure out, "okay, we can get results to people in real time..." Now we're getting granular results to specific people in the organization based on their data in real-time every single day - so it's really... it's evolved as an
industry, and it's obviously become much more technology-driven, and we've certainly followed that and invested a lot in technology. Here was our first kind of landing page for folks - we called it "eSurvey" and we had a qualitative offer... But what hasn't changed, I think, and it's what our clients I think value still, and I think many clients do, is, you know, how do we ask the right... what are the right questions to ask, to the right people, at the right time so we can get this great operationalized CX data to all of our people and they can take action on it. That still hasn't gone away. Although it's been de-emphasized, and I think... You know, it's something that I still always pound my fist on - like, "hey, you have to be able to design good studies - even if technology is carrying a lot of the heavy weight these days." Then we evolved to 1600 Market Street. This is kind of a journey in time, and nobody here on the Zoom meeting has been at PeopleMetrics yet, so I'll take this one. Here are some folks who who were with the team then, and there's another Reason Research person, Heather... We've got Sanjeev, who was one of our long-term employees and now is at Vanguard... and it's really rewarding, by the way, to see people who you helped, you hired as very, like, entry-level people and see them grow and evolve into incredible professionals and, you know, in some cases, doing unbelievable work beyond the work I'm doing. It's very very rewarding to see that happen, and it's the most rewarding part of this job, for sure, is to see people develop. And whatever path they take is fine and it's great, and I'm really happy for all the people we're seeing here. This was one of our first looks at the reporting that we had in the application. Current clients know that it looks a lot different now. It certainly was something that was good back then, but it sure does look dated today, doesn't it folks?
Madeline: Yeah, that old Internet Explorer is ancient.
Sean: Our application only worked on Internet Explorer for a long time. Okay, then we actually went to Arch Street. It was a long long journey and a couple of you have joined me on this journey, right? Kirk and Ripal were both in that office, right?
So there's Murley again, there's a bunch of people - there's Gary and Kate, two of my favorite people. Gary runs Reason Research, Kate is heading Culture, Diversity and other things at Lincoln Financial Group. Incredible people, incredible talent. We would not be here today without both of them, that's for sure. Just an amazing group of people in these pictures as well. So I'm going to ask you guys a question... So I'll start with you, Kirk. You know, you joined PeopleMetrics in what, 2012 you said?
Kirk: 2012, yeah.
Sean: When you joined the company and you were getting into this industry of customer experience, employee experience and some market research that we were doing back then, what did you expect it to be? And then what has it evolved into?
Kirk: Yeah, well I'm not quite sure I had any expectations coming into it. I think at the time when I started, my only understanding of customer feedback was as a customer of... I take a survey, and then at the time, my only thinking of it was, "this goes into a void and then I don't know what happens with it." Starting at PeopleMetrics was learning what happens with it if you're actually serious about it. So I think the biggest change in my understanding and what I learned the most was how much work goes into those three things that you just said of asking the right questions, to the right people, and getting it in front of the right hands to take action on it. When I started, a lot of what I did was reading through individual comments - doing some of that really heavy work and analysis that then builds up into larger and larger reports, and that was something that I think I understand now today after all that time and work, is that what the best companies do is spend a lot of that time understanding your customers feedback, and then put it back out there that, "I read it, I made changes, and here's what we did," because that's the thing that prior to me getting into customer feedback I didn't fully understand.
Sean: You know, one other thing that I'll say that's dramatically changed since I started in this industry... just building on what you said, Kirk, is - you know, technology definitely has changed the whole industry, without a doubt, but the acceptance... I would call it... of individual feedback - individual customer feedback - being revealed, not anonymous, and followed up on is a huge change. Like when we first started doing this, my market research friends were telling me that I was like violating every single standard of
market research of respondent anonymity... and I was arguing back then that as long as we had the permission of the customer to have a follow-up, that we're doing the customer a service, and this is not market research what we're doing - this is customer experience management. We're measuring after a touchpoint, hopefully a "moment of truth." We're identifying what that moment of truth is, and we're empowering the client to understand how that moment of truth is going, and following up on customers who have had a poor experience. And not just following up - managing
it through a specific process that we call "case management" that we've always had in our product. That was radically different. And I had debates with people for the first 10 years of the company - even while we were at Arch Street - even in this phase - that "you can't do that" - I'm like well, people are now... You know... social - that's back when MySpace and some of the initial social media was going, and then we had Twitter and Facebook and people were sharing what they had for lunch and everything else, and I'm like, "you really don't think people want to follow up when they have a poor experience? I think they do." And now that is not... I don't even think that's controversial anymore, right team? Like we don't have conversations about whether that's something that can happen - that just happens. So I just want to point that out. That this was still going on in this phase of the industry.
Kirk: Yeah, and one last thing I'd piggyback on that you mentioned, as far as just awareness at the time... When I first joined, we were having a lot more conversations with clients about,
"customer experience is not customer service," and that's much better understood now. Just generally, folks understand
that experience extends across everything. It is the experience, it's everything that we provide to customers. It's not just when something goes wrong how do I fix it? And that was a mindset shift that's been a long time coming.
Sean: Here's a shameless plug: in my book, Listen or Die, there's a chapter that is specifically called "The Difference Between Customer Experience and Customer Service" that I think, Madeline, is one of the more popular chapters in the book, and something we've gotten a lot of good comments on.
Madeline: Yeah, we actually did a PeopleMetrics LIVE! all about this too, so we'll link to that so you can watch it.
Sean: Ripal, I have a question for you. Ripal, you joined right around 2011. Now it's 2021 - 10 years later. What was the... and I've said that the customer experience world has become more and more technology-driven... What are some of the changes you've seen since you first got to PeopleMetrics, in terms of our product compared to what it is today?
Ripal: Sean, I'll say that during my tenure at PeopleMetrics, the most important lesson which I learned is that the technology is accelerating at such a speed that we have to keep up-to-date with our product as well as ourselves. So there are many to keep up-to-date with changes and some of them are like... you can be a part of the community membership or podcasts, books, training courses and all that stuff. The reason I talked about keeping ourselves up-to-date first, then the product is if we keep up-to-date with the technology trends, then we direct the product in the right direction. And that's what exactly we did at the PeopleMetrics as we are seeing through the slides previously. We used to use like ASPs and dot nets and that all kind of technologies - instead of that, nowadays we are using cloud services and the newer technologies, which exactly matches the current trends. And that's what making our product successful.
Sean: Audrey, I want to get you in the conversation. You joined in our current office - which we no longer are at, by the way, we are remote because of COVID - but this is where our office is. You've seen the product come a long way, right? From the days that you came in versus today. What are your insights on that?
Audrey: Yeah, even in just the last four years there has been so much evolution of the product and features added, so it's been pretty exciting to be a part of. But yeah, when I started, even my knowledge of customer experience was pretty limited. I was familiar with surveys, but more on the market research side of things, and I knew about focus groups, but I didn't know about e-focus groups - things that we do here - so it's been a great learning experience to get up to speed on customer experience and how everything works. And really I work directly with our clients, so I have a lot of knowledge from things they've done and how the programs have impacted their bottom line and and changed things at their companies, which is really exciting to see and be a part of.
Sean: Yeah and I'd say that this phase of the customer experience world has really shifted into text analytics, machine learning, you know, analytics on the fly within the platform... like those are things we've invested in, and a lot of the industry is invested in. And it would have been unheard of 10 years ago or longer - to be able to
see open-ended comments that could be at least made sense of in real-time by a machine. Not as good as a person, right? It's not what it's meant for - but at 80-85 percent of what a person can do and identify trends at scale, it's just really amazing what things like that can do. And the fact now it's really easy to show statistical significance within, for instance, our platform, where before we would have to shift it into SPSS or SAS and run it and then get it back to the client - it's like there's so much more that you can do now on the fly than you ever could previously. Audrey, you've seen that even being involved over the last few years.
Audrey: Yeah, the big thing with text analytics is being able to do it at scale. Most of our clients have analysts who can read comments, but nobody can read them in real-time at scale. We have clients that get thousands of responses a day and our text analytics allows them to pinpoint what is important and then be able to focus on that rather than just trying to comb through comments. And same thing with the statistics feature that we have - they can easily see if changes and numbers are statistically significant or not without having to pull the data out and do a ton of analysis. So I think our platform has really helped people streamline and get things done more quickly and then get to the heart of what's important in their data.
Sean: Without a doubt. Madeline, you joined here around this time, right? Up there's some pictures of some folks. What were your expectations when you were entering this industry and how are they different than what actually happened?
Madeline: I would say my thoughts about customer experience are similar to Kirk's - I didn't really have any expectations coming in. I of course knew you could take surveys on the bottom of a receipt or that kind of thing, but this was, for me, learning about customer experience and survey feedback and closed loop processes and all that kind of stuff, really. It suddenly put words to experiences that I have been having my whole life and continue to have as a consumer that I didn't... I was able to put vocabulary words with things that happened to me all the time. So, you know, able to see, "oh, I had a bad experience at that restaurant, and here I am telling all of my friends that it was terrible," and learning about how that is "word of mouth," and how you want to prevent that, and how that can be prevented by following up with a customer after they indicate that they've had a negative experience... Just all those kinds of things, I think similar to Kirk, I didn't know that there was such a process behind survey feedback that actually is operationalized and used to improve the experience so that you're avoiding those kinds of conversations happening on the consumer end, and you are getting more of the opposite - which is people going to their friends and saying, "oh my gosh, the customer service person I just talked to was so cool and they solved my problem and I feel like we're friends," and, you know, the kinds of experiences that you remember when you've had a great experience with a brand. I just didn't know that all that stuff was behind surveys, and I think to this day, I just continue to experience that myself - just as a consumer. I love it.
Sean: Yeah, I think the cool thing about customer experience management or experience management in general is it still has the good parts about what market research does, and that's identify systemic issues that a company needs to focus on and fix in order to have a wide impact among all of their customers. And that's a really great thing about what market research does. But it also allows companies to understand what Madeline's personal experience was, understand if it was poor, you could follow up on it right away, and that provides kind of a dual benefit that I think this has that a lot of other types of research just does not have. And it's an amazing business benefit and it's why it's become a category. Forrester and Gartner are covering this... it's a category and there's reasons for that because companies are getting a lot of value out of these programs.
Madeline: Definitely. I think the other side that I didn't realize either was the employee experience side of it and how tied great employee performance is tied to great customer experiences, and and being able hear almost immediately - or immediately - that you have delivered a great experience and here's why. That's just great to hear as an employee and you're able to continue delivering great experiences like that. That was a part that I didn't have vision into until coming here.
Sean: There's a good picture of our official launch of the new platform. I'm sure some people probably don't know this, but we have rebuilt our product from the ground up. We had what we call a "legacy product" that had a little bit of old technology, which Ripal was talking about a moment ago, and we decided to rebuild it with a modern technology stack. And that picture on the bottom left of the blue shirts was when we launched that product officially, and that's really been the spark in terms of where we are today with a great team. And this is our website today where we're helping companies improve the customer, employee... and we have a really specific focus on "Pharma CX" we call it, which is helping pharmaceutical companies improve the experiences of
their customers, which are patients, hcps, caregivers and other stakeholders. So we're super excited to have focused on the experience economy. We think that companies don't launch products anymore, they launch experiences. No matter what industry you're in, experiences are about the only thing that differentiates companies these days for the most part. Unless you have some sort of monopoly power over customers, it's
everything. And measuring those and managing those and improving those is what we do. This is the product now. It looks very different than some of those pictures we had in the past, right, Ripal? It's like a completely different thing.
Ripal: Yeah, it's completely different. It's a new of the PeopleMetrics, as well as I will say that it's a more real-time than the previous product we had - like you get the real-time analysis, you can dynamically create a matrix, you can response immediately to any alerts over there, so it's a really great product.
Sean: Yeah, and it's a privilege to get this data in the hands of our clients and their people every day to see their data so they can make better decisions on behalf of their customers, clients, patients, whomever their key stakeholders are, and that's really what it's all about. This is all done to help our clients do a better job for their customers, and ultimately that makes the world, I think, a better place to live and certainly a better place to do business in. And that's some of the current team today. We did a holiday video for all of our clients and that's us waving at that point. Alright, so we're at about five minutes left. Madeline, should we tackle some of the future stuff now?
Madeline: Sure yeah - let's just go around, and Sean, I'll start
with you. We just spent this half hour looking back at the past 20 years and how things have changed. Obviously change is accelerating as we go into the future, so what do think will be trends for the next 20 years?
Sean: I'll throw in a couple, and this one is counterintuitive maybe, given all the emphasis on technology in the space, but I think highly specialized vertical knowledge is going to become more and more valuable. So I think pharmaceutical companies are going to want to buy from companies that know that industry and telecommunications companies are going to want to buy from somebody who knows that industry. And the reason is at the end of the day , maybe somebody's technology's a little better or looks nicer than another, but if you're not asking the right questions to the right people to get the results that you can act on in a language that your customers can understand and relate to, then the technology doesn't matter. So I think that's a huge trend that's going to continue, and I think we're seeing that already. I think highly specialized vertical knowledge is absolutely key. I think we're going to see more and more non-survey data get attached to the products. So operational data - whatever you want to call it - I think you're going to start seeing true 360 views of customers with data - not just on their survey, what they said on the survey, but how they've behaved over time from data that the client has collected. So I think those are two things that I would point to that will shape the industry going forward.
Madeline: Audrey, Kirk, Ripal - what do you guys all think?
Sean: Kirk, you want to kick it off?
Kirk: Yeah, I'm happy to kick it off. I'll say one for me that we've been seeing in recent years, and I think will continue to develop, is more and more industries understanding that they need to measure and define their customer experience. Back when I started in 2012, you really just had these core industries that said, "you know, I'm hospitality, I'm a restaurant... I need to measure the customer experience." Since then, that's really grown into everyone understands, "if my product is getting to an end customer (which every product is), I need to have some understanding of the experience throughout that." Specifically, I spend more of my time now working with pharmaceutical companies where they're understanding they need to make it as easy as possible for their patients to get access to their medication. That was never something that was a defined understanding for them before, and it's even growing to "how are our clinical trials going?" - not just "what is your experience with medication" - so I would suspect - and if you're on this call as a CX operator today, that's something that you need to be mindful of for the future is: am I collecting the full range of customer experience? Because probably you're not thinking with the full lens of how the customer gets to your end product. So that's where you
should be thinking ahead.
Sean: How about you, Audrey - what are you thinking about the future?
Audrey: I think that we're going to continue to see more and more people with access to this data within companies that are collecting it. I think probably the history of it was that it went to a core team of people who analyzed it and and worked with it, but something that we've done at PeopleMetrics is allow unlimited user licenses to access our platform so that everybody is able to see this data and understand what's going on. So I do think you have to have a targeted loop-closing process and know what you're doing with it. But I think the more people that have access to it within an organization, the better off you are. Even the call center rep should should see what customers are saying that the site leader should know. So I think we're going to continue to see that trend with more people looking at the data and understanding why it's important.
Sean: What about you, Ripal? Anything you want to add to what we were talking about?
Ripal: Definitely. I'll say that the text analytics or we can call it a machine learning, that's a really important part going forward, as it's going to analyze the results of the feedback very quickly in real-time. That's really going to help out to understand the whole 360 view of the of the experience, definitely. And I would add to that that that is certainly because the present and future, and it's something that will only get more sophisticated in terms of identifying themes from open-ended comments, as well as identifying trends - even from quantitative data that's coming in.
Sean: So Madeline, we're a little bit over. I think we have one question - shall we try it?
Madeline: Yeah definitely. So the question here is: "how do you start a customer experience business in a culture that has serious issues with customer experience and service?"
Sean: That's a great question. First of all - and in fact, it's such a great question, it was the number one chapter in my book, Listen or Die - it was titled "Everybody Wants To Be Customer-Centric, But Nobody Knows What That Means or How To Do That." And I would recommend reading that chapter for sure in the book. But the way companies turn around an organization that may not be performing the way they want to with regard to customer experience is they need to take a step back. Leadership - it's really important to start there - has to believe that the customer experience is important. If they believe that's important, then that solves a lot of issues. And then the next step always in my opinion is to set up a listening program around a key "moment of truth," or a touch point that matters a lot to your customers. And that data - that customer feedback - doesn't sit in a silo. It sits across the organization. Everybody has visibility to it. The data gets put in the hands of people who can change the experience for those customers or clients. And you systematically work up... There's no like magic bullet on this, but the magic bullet really is - if there isn't one, it's identify that number one "moment of truth." Start listening and start following up and acting on that feedback. And then things will start to slowly change. You'll start delivering better customer experiences. You'll have less problems. People will start seeing, "wow, this part of the organization is really performing well and it can make a difference." And then that will spread across the organization. Audrey, Kirk - I'd love to hear your thoughts on that one as well.
Kirk: Yeah, what I'd add to that... I think that that is a great question uh as far as... Sean's right - you need to start with leadership buy-in.
I think that's also a very easy place to start because there's so much information out there about how customer satisfaction relates to customer churn, it relates to customer spend, it relates to loyalty... So making that case is very clear because we could say, "we need to know this, we need to improve it." Also if you suspect there's a poor customer experience or poor customer service today, you've probably heard some of that from customers. You probably have an email or some feedback from customers, or you can say "this is why customer satisfaction matters, XYZ - and also we're hearing kind of nuance or aspects of this from customers today, so we need to measure it," and then from there you go into that point where you show and prove. You start with a program at a key touch point, show how then you know where our scores are improving we've identified items and we're taking action, and that's how you grow from there.
Audrey: Yeah, the first thing I thought of was identifying a moment of truth that really impacts your business. I think using that to get
leadership buy-in will help you. If you can, like Kirk said, figure out where people have already provided some sort of feedback and said there's a problem and go to your leadership with a solution, with a suggestion for how to improve it, you're already part of the way there.
Sean: Yeah and I would say that building an ROI case based on that
moment of truth, or even beforehand, is huge in terms of getting leadership buy-in. So that's probably the first thing I would do is - and there's a bunch of data in Listen or Die - you can listen or you can go on the internet and find stuff too on terms of ROI data in terms of listening and taking action. But you know, it's nothing like doing it yourself and showing an ROI, right? So there's probably two levels to it. But that ROI case is absolutely huge, and that's certainly where I'd begin.
Madeline: Alright, well this has been such a fun session going and looking back at where we've been and looking ahead at where we're heading.
Sean: I just want to thank every employee who's ever partnered with me at PeopleMetrics and every client. It's been my greatest privilege. Next to having children, this is my the greatest honor in my life is to work with you and serve you as clients and help you. It's been 20 years, I never could have imagined it. Here's to 20 more.
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Posted on 01-28-2021